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View Full Version : Are Facebook Right To Allow Beheading Videos


rhondda rudie
23rd October 2013, 11:00 AM
Please discuss.

ANiMALicious
23rd October 2013, 12:43 PM
no.


Ani

Soul Adventurer
23rd October 2013, 01:02 PM
I don't think they're right but then I wonder why anyone would want to watch them.

JB40
23rd October 2013, 01:59 PM
I don't know about that Imani.

if we cast our minds back to those old black-and-white days of our youth I'm sure that most of us as teenagers would be tempted to look at all sorts of things that are available on line.

Obviously sexual content would have been accessed immediately, particularly as pornography was illegal when we were lads. are we saying that we WOULDN't be tempted to look at this kind of violent material as well. The temptation to a teenager would be very hard ignore. Young people, particularly young men, would find very hard not to satisfy that curiosity.

The voyeuristic nature of the internet means that anything can be found in a few seconds. The temptation and curiosity is just human nature. My advice to my kids has always been, be careful what you access on line. One day you might see something you regret. It can't be UNseen afterwards.

A freind of mine once watched a video of a beheading during the iraq war. he wishes now that he had never done that. he will never forget what he saw [and heard], and he gets flash-backs regularly. It's found it's way into his dreams to the point that sometimes he doesn't want to sleep in case he dreams about it again. That sounds to me like he's been traumatized.

It may sound strange coming from me. I love violent and disturbing movies. But I think there is a massive fundamental difference between something real or not real. Films of beheadings are SNUFF movies, watching real stuff can traumatize in a way that pretend violence never can.

Violence is part of human nature, and violent entertainment can act as a vicarious release for this. Violent entertainment can be an over-all benefit to society as a whole. Playing violent video games is better than acting out our fantasies in real life.

nasty videos are as popular as vids of cute kittens. epic fails, happy slapping, street fights, accidents etc are shared millions of times every day. When I was a lad I woiuld have looked at that stuff, now I'm a bit older I let people know that I don't want them to share violent stuff with me, I'm not interested in seeing it.

STING
23rd October 2013, 04:31 PM
I don't think they're right but then I wonder why anyone would want to watch them.

that's it exactly. i don't gi a shit cos i wunt watch em anyway x

Soul Adventurer
23rd October 2013, 05:10 PM
I don't know about that Imani.

if we cast our minds back to those old black-and-white days of our youth I'm sure that most of us as teenagers would be tempted to look at all sorts of things that are available on line.

Obviously sexual content would have been accessed immediately, particularly as pornography was illegal when we were lads. are we saying that we WOULDN't be tempted to look at this kind of violent material as well. The temptation to a teenager would be very hard ignore. Young people, particularly young men, would find very hard not to satisfy that curiosity.

The voyeuristic nature of the internet means that anything can be found in a few seconds. The temptation and curiosity is just human nature. My advice to my kids has always been, be careful what you access on line. One day you might see something you regret. It can't be UNseen afterwards.

A freind of mine once watched a video of a beheading during the iraq war. he wishes now that he had never done that. he will never forget what he saw [and heard], and he gets flash-backs regularly. It's found it's way into his dreams to the point that sometimes he doesn't want to sleep in case he dreams about it again. That sounds to me like he's been traumatized.

It may sound strange coming from me. I love violent and disturbing movies. But I think there is a massive fundamental difference between something real or not real. Films of beheadings are SNUFF movies, watching real stuff can traumatize in a way that pretend violence never can.

Violence is part of human nature, and violent entertainment can act as a vicarious release for this. Violent entertainment can be an over-all benefit to society as a whole. Playing violent video games is better than acting out our fantasies in real life.

nasty videos are as popular as vids of cute kittens. epic fails, happy slapping, street fights, accidents etc are shared millions of times every day. When I was a lad I woiuld have looked at that stuff, now I'm a bit older I let people know that I don't want them to share violent stuff with me, I'm not interested in seeing it.

I know that the censure of one social media site isn't going to stop people who really want to view this material, Jimmy. And yes, look at films going way back like A Clockwork Orange and how popular they were.

I was just saying in this specific instance I don't applaud Facebook for allowing these videos, nor do I believe that banning them makes that much difference.

Soul Adventurer
23rd October 2013, 05:12 PM
that's it exactly. i don't gi a shit cos i wunt watch em anyway x

I'd rather use Facebook to quote Partridge. Unless he beheads Lynn in one episode and no-one's told me. :haha:

j59
23rd October 2013, 05:59 PM
I don't think they're right but then I wonder why anyone would want to watch them.

Yes, my immediate thought Imani.

Read Jimmy's reply too ... guess some peeps will always want to peep. But yes agree they will most likely regret it.

Back in the B/W days of telly my mum and dad were watching a programme on adventures in Africa where a woman was tied upside down, legs apart then someone slice her through with a knife ... there hadn't been any warning before it happened. Parents were horrified.

love j x

Soul Adventurer
23rd October 2013, 06:58 PM
Well, I tell you this much... potentially it's a fantastic way for any artist struggling to get views on Youtube. Picture this - a video of some unknown singer songwriter accompanying herself on guitar singing some glorious love ballad. Then, instead of an instrumental break, cut away to a piece of footage of someone getting their head chopped off (er, but not the singer - she's only halfway through the bloody song!). :-o

JB40
23rd October 2013, 08:58 PM
sounds like the plot of that paddy chayefski novel 'network', where a newsreader promises to commit suicide on air and his ratings go through the roof.

And that's my point.

It's not enough to say 'I wouldn't watch it' or 'i'm not interested'. it's a fact of life. it could even be suggested that these violent images are more likely to put people off inflicting violence on others because they show the REAL consequences of those kind of actions. better that than the sanitized violence of the average action movie.

Al jazeera's coverage of conflicts in the middle east was criticized for being too graphic, but it could be argued that they were just being more honest about the consequences of war.

kate13
23rd October 2013, 09:11 PM
Imani i've heard about that song, not seen it, personally it's not sumit i'd look for....FB a strange thing, some innocient conversations it can ban you from having, one day try bird watching, ohhh i saw a lovely blue tit today...banned....yet behead someone isn't she lovely.

if we cast our minds back to those old black-and-white days of our youth I'm sure that most of us as teenagers would be tempted to look at all sorts of things that are available on line.


One thing springs into my head, how many girls could u fit into a telehone box ringing up to listen to the ripper tapes...what they were and what your imagination thought was completely different.

FATHER TED2
23rd October 2013, 09:26 PM
I may be cynical but I suspect it's a cheap ploy by the owners of face book to attract members or get existing members to log in, I understand them saying we can watch as long as we don't post certain comments, but I would think just watching them alone, is distasteful in itself
Also it smacks of hypocrisy, let's remember the misfortunate people in these videos, have families, people who care for them, whilst I would never wish this to happen, even with all their wealth and security, who's to say a member of the owner of Facebook won't one day find themselves at the mercy of executioners, if that day ever comes, don't expect to see it on Facebook

Soul Adventurer
24th October 2013, 07:56 AM
sounds like the plot of that paddy chayefski novel 'network', where a newsreader promises to commit suicide on air and his ratings go through the roof.

And that's my point.

It's not enough to say 'I wouldn't watch it' or 'i'm not interested'. it's a fact of life. it could even be suggested that these violent images are more likely to put people off inflicting violence on others because they show the REAL consequences of those kind of actions. better that than the sanitized violence of the average action movie.

Al jazeera's coverage of conflicts in the middle east was criticized for being too graphic, but it could be argued that they were just being more honest about the consequences of war.

The difference is when you see Al Jazeera's footage, you're given a context - much as if you do when you see a documentary about lynching or the concentration camps in WW2, where you see these horrible images. Again, the images are usually accompanied by a narrative, it's not gore for gore's sake. The 'craze' for beheading footage seems far more gratuitous, far more out of context and more to do with 'horror/fear porn'.

Sometimes I wonder if showing violence acts as a deterrent, e.g., knife-crime and 'happy slapping' seemed to increase when those vids were given airtime on Youtube.

Soul Adventurer
24th October 2013, 07:59 AM
Imani i've heard about that song, not seen it, personally it's not sumit i'd look for....FB a strange thing, some innocient conversations it can ban you from having, one day try bird watching, ohhh i saw a lovely blue tit today...banned....yet behead someone isn't she lovely.

if we cast our minds back to those old black-and-white days of our youth I'm sure that most of us as teenagers would be tempted to look at all sorts of things that are available on line.


One thing springs into my head, how many girls could u fit into a telehone box ringing up to listen to the ripper tapes...what they were and what your imagination thought was completely different.

Kathie, that was just my nutty mind making up that song/video - ;-)
But yes I can see the hypocrisy

@ Eammon... completely agree.

mrClaypole
24th October 2013, 12:47 PM
I may be cynical but I suspect it's a cheap ploy by the owners of face book to attract members or get existing members to log in, I understand them saying we can watch as long as we don't post certain comments, but I would think just watching them alone, is distasteful in itself
Also it smacks of hypocrisy, let's remember the misfortunate people in these videos, have families, people who care for them, whilst I would never wish this to happen, even with all their wealth and security, who's to say a member of the owner of Facebook won't one day find themselves at the mercy of executioners, if that day ever comes, don't expect to see it on Facebook

I have to admit to watching a beheading video afew years ago, it was of a young Russian lad having his head cut off by the Taliban back when they were fighting their war. I dont know what made me do it, I guess it was just curiosity, I have to admit that it totally has traumatized me, it was such a callous act carried out by someone who didnt appear to care about the screams of pain from this young kid, the pleadings he was making to his mother as the butcher brutally hacked at his neck with a blunt knife. I saw it through to the end more shocked than anything to turn it off. But since that day afew years ago I can still hear the screams sometimes of that poor victim of brutality. Ive never ever wanted to satify any kind of urge to see anything like that again and I get very angry with people who try and send me links or say to me "watch this video its sick". I had a go at my uncle afew weeks ago as he tried to show me a video of 2 mexican men having their heads chainsawed off, I said to him how can you get any enjoyment out of that, think of their families, thinkl of the fact if you ever found yourself in that position would you like your death used as entertainment?.

The trouble with the net its made us cold to these things and desensitizes us to the violence, I have confirmed in my soul after my experience that I could no more kill someone as I know how its affected me, but some people with violent tendencies could use it as a way of justifying carrying out the real thing by themselves as if they watch that stuff all the time then they equate it with reality. To me that is the real danger.

As for Facebook, Im using it less and less everyday as I dont agree with what they allow to share or indeed what information and personal things they own of mine. Social media can be a good thing, but there has to be some caution and Im usually for openess and non censorship but Im a grown man and ive managed to deal with the emotional upheaval of what I saw, Im not sure a young impressionable teen could deal with it the same way.

rhondda rudie
24th October 2013, 02:17 PM
Great replies,thanks guys.

Like jb I was going to mention Al Jazeera.I think they do us a great service in demonstrating war is not all about marching bands and getting medals.

Facebook has now given in to pressure and banned beheading videos which I agree with although,as others said they are easily accessible elsewhere.Facebook seems to have a strange censorship policy as videos of mothers breastfeeding were banned but it was seemingly ok to show beheading.:-?

On a final note the beheading video in question was of a young Syrian soldier being beheaded by rebels.Maybe it would be a good idea to force all UK and US politicians in favour of arming the rebels to watch it.

JB40
24th October 2013, 02:49 PM
I have to admit to watching a beheading video afew years ago, it was of a young Russian lad having his head cut off by the Taliban back when they were fighting their war. I dont know what made me do it, I guess it was just curiosity, I have to admit that it totally has traumatized me, it was such a callous act carried out by someone who didnt appear to care about the screams of pain from this young kid, the pleadings he was making to his mother as the butcher brutally hacked at his neck with a blunt knife. I saw it through to the end more shocked than anything to turn it off. But since that day afew years ago I can still hear the screams sometimes of that poor victim of brutality. Ive never ever wanted to satify any kind of urge to see anything like that again and I get very angry with people who try and send me links or say to me "watch this video its sick". I had a go at my uncle afew weeks ago as he tried to show me a video of 2 mexican men having their heads chainsawed off, I said to him how can you get any enjoyment out of that, think of their families, thinkl of the fact if you ever found yourself in that position would you like your death used as entertainment?.

The trouble with the net its made us cold to these things and desensitizes us to the violence, I have confirmed in my soul after my experience that I could no more kill someone as I know how its affected me, but some people with violent tendencies could use it as a way of justifying carrying out the real thing by themselves as if they watch that stuff all the time then they equate it with reality. To me that is the real danger.

As for Facebook, Im using it less and less everyday as I dont agree with what they allow to share or indeed what information and personal things they own of mine. Social media can be a good thing, but there has to be some caution and Im usually for openess and non censorship but Im a grown man and ive managed to deal with the emotional upheaval of what I saw, Im not sure a young impressionable teen could deal with it the same way.



A horrible story there Mr C.

I wouldn't swap places with you. I've managed to avoid all this stuff that is swilling about on the net. I know I couldn't sit through a video like that. I remember walking in on a mate while he was watching 'faces of death', a video easily available a few years back. I had to walk out of the house after 10 minutes, and what I did see has left an impression. A long distance shot of a saudi beheading in a stadium was enough for me to know I didn't want to see any more. Anyway, I'm a wimp when it comes to real stuff. I can't watch A&E docs or road accident rescue progs. And needles on TV make me squirm.

I know we both have a love of strange and disturbing movies, but that is obviously no indication of an appetite for any of this real stuff. Just as i don't think kids playing violent video games means they want to slaughter in real life.

Maybe we worry too much about kids. It's teenage boys that are most likely to enjoy this kind of stuff because that's what teenage boys do. When your a young lad you have a very shallow view of life. Callow youth they call it. At that age you really don't appreciate the consequences of your action. Death means nothing, at that age you live forever. When you get older things change. you become more aware of your own mortality, and more sensitive to others. You know how easily bad things can happen, and you can better understand the meaning of loss. When your young you don't care about those things.

Which is why I think the idea of people being desensitized after being exposed to these videos is a bit of a red herring.

Watch it when your 18 and it's like watching a movie, watch it when your 45 and it's like witnessing your own death.

JB40
24th October 2013, 02:54 PM
Great replies,thanks guys.

Like jb I was going to mention Al Jazeera.I think they do us a great service in demonstrating war is not all about marching bands and getting medals.

Facebook has now given in to pressure and banned beheading videos which I agree with although,as others said they are easily accessible elsewhere.Facebook seems to have a strange censorship policy as videos of mothers breastfeeding were banned but it was seemingly ok to show beheading.:-?

On a final note the beheading video in question was of a young Syrian soldier being beheaded by rebels.Maybe it would be a good idea to force all UK and US politicians in favour of arming the rebels to watch it.



Quite right about syria comrade.

i remember martin bell, the one time war correspondent, saying that the reason blair so blithely made the order to invade Iraq, with the resulting deaths of hundreds of thousands of innocent people, was because he had never ever been near a war zone. blair was a pen-pusher who lived an easy life and had no understanding of the consequences of his actions. A bit of exposure to a few atrocities would have done him [and a hell of a lot of iraqi's] a big favor.

rhondda rudie
24th October 2013, 03:00 PM
Quite right about syria comrade.

i remember martin bell, the one time war correspondent, saying that the reason blair so blithely made the order to invade Iraq, with the resulting deaths of hundreds of thousands of innocent people, was because he had never ever been near a war zone. blair was a pen-pusher who lived an easy life and had no understanding of the consequences of his actions. A bit of exposure to a few atrocities would have done him [and a hell of a lot of iraqi's] a big favor.

Afternoon Jimmy.Yes Blair's legacy becomes more toxic by the day.I still say he was after his own "Falklands Factor".Western powers still seem to be advancing a "good guy,bad guy" script in the middle east when it should be obvious that reality is far more complicated.

JB40
24th October 2013, 03:35 PM
afternoon comrade.

don't forget goldman sachs in all this. They are the go-to company for financing oil deals. It's what blair still does on behalf of his bosses. He has brokered a deal for palestinian oil [not owned by the palestinians of course], and he's brokered a deal in kazakhstan too recently. That's how he makes his dodgy [tax-free] millions. A journey he started while in office.

despite the continuing anarchy, and all that death and destruction, some people made a fortune out of iraq. goldmans and blair are the big winners.

despicable c*nt.

[excuse my french]

pedromenedro
24th October 2013, 06:31 PM
I remember being at work when I walked into and office where to my amazement there were about 5 blokes around a computer watching a beheading video, I am sure it was during the war in iraq, when I realised what they were watching I could not get out of thier fast enough.
These fellas were watching eagerly, some of them laughing 'whoa...look at that..ouch'
One of them was amazed that I wouldn't have any of it....some people really are sick.

mrClaypole
25th October 2013, 12:11 PM
I remember being at work when I walked into and office where to my amazement there were about 5 blokes around a computer watching a beheading video, I am sure it was during the war in iraq, when I realised what they were watching I could not get out of thier fast enough.
These fellas were watching eagerly, some of them laughing 'whoa...look at that..ouch'
One of them was amazed that I wouldn't have any of it....some people really are sick.

There is a psychological effect of seeing it on screen, the barrier is up when you watch it on a PC/ phone or whatever, somehow it tricks the mind into thinking your watching something that is fictional like a tv or film. Ask whoe ever next time if it happens again, tell them would you enjoy being in the same room watching it live?.

Ive personally heard sounds that I never thought I could hear a human being make, if only it was possible to wipe certain things from your memory.

As for politicians, they will never know the true nature of the brutality of war, my brother has served in Iraq and Afghanistan and he has seen some really awful things, things that when a politician comes over to do a photocall to boost his ego, never gets told about. They get a glossed over, everythings going brilliantly version of events, not the scooping bits of your fellow soldiers into bin bags reality.

But even if they did get to view the reality, it wouldnt stop them sending other peoples children over to fight, they have to think of their balance sheets afterall, whats afew body parts/ grieving families when youve got millions to make for your self and your pay masters?.

Saad
25th October 2013, 02:41 PM
I remember being at work when I walked into and office where to my amazement there were about 5 blokes around a computer watching a beheading video, I am sure it was during the war in iraq, when I realised what they were watching I could not get out of thier fast enough.
These fellas were watching eagerly, some of them laughing 'whoa...look at that..ouch'
One of them was amazed that I wouldn't have any of it....some people really are sick.


If they'd been my employees I would have sacked them on the spot.

Some people are just plain sick.

As has been said - context is all.

JB40
25th October 2013, 03:27 PM
5 blokes around a computer, wonder how old they were.?

Part of the problem is peer pressure and pack mentality.

a mate of mine has a 17 year old son. he's a sensitive lad and he's not comfortable with some of the videos his mates share with each other. But what can he do ? he'll get the wrath of the mob if he tries to make a fuss about it. he'll be accused of being 'gay' or a mommy's boy. No young lad wants to be turned on by their peers.

I think the culture of young men sees this as some kind of right of passage. It's all about bravado. In the perverse world of young males the more casual you are when witnessing these atrocities, the more of a man you are. The boys playground at school is like 'the lord of the flies' and these videos feed in to that.

Young males are like savages that need to be civilized. And this is biggest demographic for consumers of snuff videos. If teenage boys stopped sharing them these videos would disappear over night I reckon.